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Permalink Reply by The Duc on July 25, 2011 at 4:19pm

The cause of death was the injuries sustained in the accident, injuries which I clearly stated may have been prevented by use of a helmet.

Actually Duc, the cause of death in all those cases was the accident. Lack of a helmet does not cause an accident. Prevent the accident, and prevent the death.............

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Permalink Reply by Mark Elliott on July 25, 2011 at 4:39pm

and the injuries were caused by??????......the accident! Prevent the accidents and deaths will go down........if a helmet makes us safer on a bike, it will make us safer in all activities.......do you wish to wear one all the time? Driving your car? Riding the bus? If we give an inch, we WILL eventually lose a mile and it will eventually encroach on you too.

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Permalink Reply by Mark Elliott on July 25, 2011 at 4:44pm

MOTORCYCLE HELMETS ARE NOT SAFE!

By Steve "Red" Barron

The present testing standard for motorcycle helmets (FMVSS-218) was created almost 30 years ago. The helmet manufacturer's are required to perform all motorcycle helmet testing in a laboratory on a headform. The result is a motorcycle helmet designed to pass the testing standard which is to protect a headform in a laboratory. The testing does not simulate what would happen to a motorcyclist wearing that helmet in the event of an actual accident. The present testing standard does not exceed a simulated impact speed of 13.66 mph, nor does it take into account the stresses that would be transferred to a motorcyclist's neck and spinal cord, the reduced vision and hearing, the effects of a chin strap around the throat, or the effect on the brain when the helmet bounces. As many State's (including California) have enacted laws that mandate motorcyclist's wear a helmet (or become a criminal), the testing standards should reflect what, exactly a helmet will do to a motorcyclist in the event of an actual accident.

If the safety of the motorcyclist is the primary concern, then the testing standards should reflect that As it stands now, the safety Nazi's say that helmets are safe, when the real troth is that helmets can only be proven to protect a headform in a laboratory. Until the testing standards are designed with the motorcyclist's safety as the primary objective, motorcyclist's who ride in mandatory helmet law States will be required, by law, to wear a helmet that is designed to protect a headform, not a motorcyclist. If the testing used crash dummies with sensors (to detect possible injuries), in realistic accident situations (like a car turning left in front of the motorcyclist), we could determine if, in fact, helmets can actually cause injuries. The laws of physics state that a 4 pound helmet, at 50 mph, becomes 200 pounds upon impact. This is a law that cannot be repealed by anyone and it is an indication that the present motorcycle helmets are not as safe as some would claim. One of the requirements of FMVSS-218 is an impact test performed by dropping the helmet (and headform) onto an anvil from a height of no more than 72 inches which simulates an impact speed of 13.66 mph. Using a Newton equation' for a 170 pound rider, with deceleration of the brain being the controlling factor, the following helmet thicknesses would be required:

IMPACT VELOCITY		HELMET THICKNESS
4 MPH		1"
10 MPH		1.8"
15 MPH		4"
20 MPH		6.5"
30 MPH		15"
40 MPH		29"

The current 1" thick helmets weigh from 2 to 4.5 pounds. If the testing were done at an impact speed of 20 mph, the helmet would have to be at least 6" thick, and weigh 15 to 20 pounds in order to pass testing. The current 4 pound helmet puts a terrible strain on the neck without impacting anything And upon impact, the bending momentum to the neck will more than double. The neck is the weakest link, and FMVSS-218 does not take this into account (as the required headform has no "neck" at all, nor does it simulate a human body at all, as it's only a headform) There have been many motorcyclist's who have become a quadriplegic due to the effects of wearing a helmet. A female motorcyclist wearing a helmet is twice as likely to die ice as likely as a male motorcyclist (this is probably due to the smaller, weaker neck of a female).

Another requirement of FMVSS-218 (S5.4) is that a helmet provides no less than 105 degrees peripheral vision. A drivers license test requires 140 degrees peripheral vision, and a motorcyclist with only 105 degrees peripheral vision is considered to be legally blind Also, when wearing a helmet, the acute decrease in hearing would prevent a person from receiving a drivers license. Therefore, according to DMV regulations, when wearing a helmet a motorcyclist is legally deaf & blind!

Helmet's are not a safety device for motorcyclist's, and mandatory helmet laws are nothing more than a mandatory dress code with the ability to cause injury and death. But a helmet will protect a headform in a laboratory (up to 13.66 mph), unfortunately, headforms do not ride motorcycles.

---

Footnote

[1] KE	=	WH		KE	=	Kinetic
	=	1/2 w/g v2		V	=	Velocity
V	=	at		W	=	Weight
g	=	1/2 at2		H	=	Height
				g	=	Acceleration of Gravity
				t	=	Time
KE	=	1.2 w/g (at)2		a	=	distance

The foregoing is a Newton equation.

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Permalink Reply by Mark Elliott on July 25, 2011 at 4:46pm

The Twisting of Data in Helmet Safety Studies

Extensive research has been done on the safety of motorcycle helmets. The most famous study of all, the Hurt Study Motorcycle Accident Cause Factors and Identification of ..., shows no question that a helmet protects the head, reducing injury severity. The main question that researchers want to answer is whether the likelihood of neck injury is more significant than the likelihood of a helmet saving the riders life.

Helmets Statistically Reduce Head Injuries, But they Don't Save Lives

The same data that was used in the Hurt Report was also used in another paper by Dr. Jonathan P. Goldstein, Ph.D. His analysis showed some facts that the Hurt Report overlooked. Although the data showed that motorcycle riders wearing helmets suffer from fewer head injuries, it failed to elaborate on what that really means. Helmet use had little significance in saving lives given that an accident had occurred.

What does that mean? It means that those who do crash are rarely saved by their helmets. Their head injuries are less severe, but they die anyway. In accidents where the rider died, it made no difference if the rider wore a helmet or not. That's not exactly a rock solid argument in favor of helmet wearing.

The truth is that speeding and alcohol use are the biggest cause of motorcycle crashes. Those taking part in these risky behaviors are less likely to wear helmets in the first place. Helmet wearers tend to have fewer crashes and less severe head injuries because they take fewer risks. This accounts for the reduced number of fatalities among helmet wearers.

Neck Injuries Probably More Likely

In light of the shaky evidence in favor of helmets, we must look at the evidence against them. Although motorcycle helmets protect the head, they tend to do so at the expense of the neck. The Hurt Report concluded that neck injuries were lessened by helmet use. How is it that Dr. Goldstein came to the opposite conclusion? Why does he say that helmets can lead to moderate or even severe neck injuries for the rider wearing the helmet? The reason for the discrepancy is not clear.

Riders report that the weight, shape and composition of the helmet all put undue force on the neck. The physics of the helmet itself can cause neck fractures during a crash. This makes Dr. Goldstein�s findings more in line with the real world experiences of many riders.

Accident Speed is Important

The speed of the helmet striking the ground makes a difference in the occurrence of neck injury. Statistics show that a helmet has to be moving at least 17 mph in order to cause a significant injury. Since most motorcycle accidents happen at just over 20 mph, there is a good chance that the helmet can cause neck damage in most accidents. Thicker helmets can cause more severe neck damage than thinner helmets because they are heavier and bounce back harder than the lighter helmets. Add to that the fact that even the best helmets are only rated up to 13 mph and a serious question becomes apparent. Is a helmet strong enough protection to make up for the increased risk of neck injury?

The Real Danger

Even the Hurt Report shows that aside from risky behaviors like speeding and alcohol use, rider inexperience causes most motorcycle accidents. Riding safety instructors drill it into riders' heads: Motorcycle riding is dangerous. Not only could it kill you, it probably will. Only when riders understand the severity of the danger will they be as alert and defensive as they should in their riding practices.

Dr. John Adams at London University did a study that showed a strange increase of fatalities in states that enacted helmet laws. He theorizes that helmeted riders took bigger risks because the helmets made them feel safer. They believed they were protected by the helmet. Sadly, that would only true in low-speed collisions. Until rider education succeeds in making every motorcyclist terrified of dying on the road, motorcycle deaths will continue to be common.

Helmet Makers Worsen the Risk

In his paper, Public safety legislation and the risk compensation hypothesis: the..., Dr. Adams noted the extensive propaganda surrounding motorcycle helmet sales. Ads encourage riders to feel safer when wearing a helmet. The problem is that people tend to be less cautious when then feel safe, leaving them more vulnerable to danger. Motorcycle riders should never feel safe. Riding is a dangerous activity that requires a consistently high level of attention and apprehension.

Helmet Laws Don't Work

Dr. Adams' paper had some more interesting statistics to offer. The report revealed one anticipated outcome: when states repealed motorcycle helmet laws, fatalities rose. Unexpectedly, however, fatalities rose by an even greater degree in states where helmet laws remained intact. It's not clear why those fatalities rose so much. However, it is clear that a lack of helmet legislation made riding a motorcycle less dangerous.

Motorcycle Insurers Encourage Helmet Use

Insurance companies tend to side with the helmet makers, because those who wear helmets tend to have fewer crashes. Insurance companies see that correlation as a factor in rating policies. Motorcycle insurance companies don�t pay for rider injuries anyway, so they put the focus on where it belongs...preventing crashes in the first place.

It's Up to You

Barring a helmet law, helmet use is a personal choice. Statistics show that if you are a responsible rider, you probably are wearing a helmet. Whether that helmet will save your life is anyone's guess. Whether it will instead cause a debilitating neck injury cannot be known. Whether you choose to ride with a helmet or without, be sure to take a safety course first, don't speed and don't drink while riding. Those actions will clearly keep you safer...the helmet? Who knows?

Jessica Bosari writes for CarInsuranceQuotesComparison.com. Her articles focus mainly on safety education and insurance tips for consumers. She believes that informed consumers are likely to get bet insurance rates when they compare car insurance companies.

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Permalink Reply by The Duc on July 25, 2011 at 4:50pm

Proper head protection can and does save lives there is no question to that fact.

It also can reduce and/or elminate serious to minor injuries.

Will it prevent them in all situations of course not.

The military, NASCAR, NFL, MLB just to name a few don't wear them for the look.

None of us wore helmets skiing or biking when we were kids but most of us who became

responsible parents made or now make sure their kids wear them same as seatbelts.

You can choose to wear or not but to say they do not help prevent injury or death is not correct.

I never said don't choose I said just remember you're making that decision not only for yourself but for others in your life. Motorcycle riding is inherently dangerous and the decision to ride should not be taken lightly.Because of past riding experiences without gear and a helmet I now choose to wear a helmet and gear.

So far the fact is they have proofed invaluable to me and saved me more serious injury and possibly my life.

 

 

 

 

I have to agree with Mark on this one. I'm really not sure as to how folks have been convinced to believe that a Helmet will save someones life. I am involved in publicity and know how effective it is as a persuasion tool. Everyone has the right to express their thoughts on this issue, but to impose them is another. If for some reason I ever change my mind about wether I wear or do not wear a helmet in the future, that is my decision. I have the same feelings about people that smoke or do not smoke or wether or not an elderly person in a nursing home wants more salt or not on his food LIVE AND LET LIVE is the philosophy for me. There are those that will advocate for the Insurance Companies, blaming the high cost of insurance on those that have been injured from any of these previous points I just made, but I say that that is all bullshit. When the law was passed for everyone to wear seatbelts, did your insurance bill go down due to all the lives and injuries that were prevented? Mine didn't. It's sort of similar to a soldier wearing more protective gear in todays battle and now the VA's have many more men & women that survived, but they need even more care than ever, due to lost limbs. It's none of my business as to how people choose to live their lives. Many accidents have  occurred with the riders wearing helmets where they were still seriously injured or killed.  Most accidents occur due to carelessness of either the operator of the Motorcycle or Motorist. Speed limits and rules of the road such as allowing adequate amount of space between you and the vehicle in front of you, being observant of road conditions, on the lookout for cars pulling out of driveways  and intersections etc... is the key to being safe. Accidents will always occur, but you can certainly minimize the possibility of being in one by excercising defensive driving skills. I believe in choice for everything I do and I'm getting tired of people that want to make my decisions for me. There are inherent risk that we take with every decision we make. I love Motorcycling and choose to ride as often as I can or wish to, the way I like to. But I limit my exposure to my risky behavior by choosing not to Downhill Ski or Ride Horses anymore. If I decide to get a rush by jumping out of plane, will you force me to wear a helmet? Will it save my life when I hit the ground at 180mph. or what if I decide to Bunge Jump again and the thing snaps and I don't die but I'm severely injured, will you stop everybody from jumping? or maybe you like to climb rocks or mountains. It's impossible to fix everything and stop people from doing what they want to do. We all have our choices, so why even think for a moment that creating a helmet law will be good for all. Have you ever had a bee go into your helmet? Talk about a major distraction that could get you killed, or how about going down the road at 65 mph and someone drifts into you for whatever reason, (cell phone, drinking, tired or sleepy, children acting up, maybe the dog that's in their lap suddenly tried to jump out the window, who the hell knows?)  I recently had a friend that wouldn't wear a helmet get in an accident where He sustained a concussion and a broken collar bone, He has now decided to wear a helmet. Good for him, He's made a decision that he feels is a good one for him, but does that mean He has the right to give everyone else a hard time for not wearing one? There were a number of factors that played a role in his accident, one of them being a parked utility vehicle on the side of the road with no cones, flag man etc... He survived his accident but will He learn more lessons from it besides the fact that when your head hits pavement it hurts? These are just my thoughts, but I am very concerned about the trend to govern us to the point where we no longer have choices in all areas of our lives.

 

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Permalink Reply by Mark Elliott on July 25, 2011 at 5:24pm

In some instances Duc, yes, but those instances are the minority and quite frankly I am tired of the minority telling me what to do. As far as my kids wearing helmets on their bicycles, I don't agree with that either. I was raised in a complex with over 400 families. Bicycles were our transportation, not our toys. We rode every day, all day and not once in that 15 year period did any of the kids in my neighborhood sustain a head injury that required medical attention. 400 families is a large enough data sample for me. But now, because a couple kids got hurt or maybe just because some outreaching parent decided we should all parent just like her, my kids have to wear a helmet to ride because it's the law. Those that choose to wear a helmet, should just close their lips and wear the damn thing.

The Duc said:

Proper head protection can and does save lives there is no question to that fact.

It also can reduce and/or elminate serious to minor injuries.

Will it prevent them in all situations of course not.

The military, NASCAR, NFL, MLB just to name a few don't wear them for the look.

None of us wore helmets skiing or biking when we were kids but most of us who became

responsible parents made or now make sure their kids wear them same as seatbelts.

You can choose to wear or not but to say they do not help prevent injury or death is not correct.

I never said don't choose I said just remember you're making that decision not only for yourself but for others in your life. Motorcycle riding is inherently dangerous and the decision to ride should not be taken lightly.Because of past riding experiences without gear and a helmet I now choose to wear a helmet and gear.

So far the fact is they have proofed invaluable to me and saved me more serious injury and possibly my life.

 

 

 

 

I have to agree with Mark on this one. I'm really not sure as to how folks have been convinced to believe that a Helmet will save someones life. I am involved in publicity and know how effective it is as a persuasion tool. Everyone has the right to express their thoughts on this issue, but to impose them is another. If for some reason I ever change my mind about wether I wear or do not wear a helmet in the future, that is my decision. I have the same feelings about people that smoke or do not smoke or wether or not an elderly person in a nursing home wants more salt or not on his food LIVE AND LET LIVE is the philosophy for me. There are those that will advocate for the Insurance Companies, blaming the high cost of insurance on those that have been injured from any of these previous points I just made, but I say that that is all bullshit. When the law was passed for everyone to wear seatbelts, did your insurance bill go down due to all the lives and injuries that were prevented? Mine didn't. It's sort of similar to a soldier wearing more protective gear in todays battle and now the VA's have many more men & women that survived, but they need even more care than ever, due to lost limbs. It's none of my business as to how people choose to live their lives. Many accidents have  occurred with the riders wearing helmets where they were still seriously injured or killed.  Most accidents occur due to carelessness of either the operator of the Motorcycle or Motorist. Speed limits and rules of the road such as allowing adequate amount of space between you and the vehicle in front of you, being observant of road conditions, on the lookout for cars pulling out of driveways  and intersections etc... is the key to being safe. Accidents will always occur, but you can certainly minimize the possibility of being in one by excercising defensive driving skills. I believe in choice for everything I do and I'm getting tired of people that want to make my decisions for me. There are inherent risk that we take with every decision we make. I love Motorcycling and choose to ride as often as I can or wish to, the way I like to. But I limit my exposure to my risky behavior by choosing not to Downhill Ski or Ride Horses anymore. If I decide to get a rush by jumping out of plane, will you force me to wear a helmet? Will it save my life when I hit the ground at 180mph. or what if I decide to Bunge Jump again and the thing snaps and I don't die but I'm severely injured, will you stop everybody from jumping? or maybe you like to climb rocks or mountains. It's impossible to fix everything and stop people from doing what they want to do. We all have our choices, so why even think for a moment that creating a helmet law will be good for all. Have you ever had a bee go into your helmet? Talk about a major distraction that could get you killed, or how about going down the road at 65 mph and someone drifts into you for whatever reason, (cell phone, drinking, tired or sleepy, children acting up, maybe the dog that's in their lap suddenly tried to jump out the window, who the hell knows?)  I recently had a friend that wouldn't wear a helmet get in an accident where He sustained a concussion and a broken collar bone, He has now decided to wear a helmet. Good for him, He's made a decision that he feels is a good one for him, but does that mean He has the right to give everyone else a hard time for not wearing one? There were a number of factors that played a role in his accident, one of them being a parked utility vehicle on the side of the road with no cones, flag man etc... He survived his accident but will He learn more lessons from it besides the fact that when your head hits pavement it hurts? These are just my thoughts, but I am very concerned about the trend to govern us to the point where we no longer have choices in all areas of our lives.

 

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Permalink Reply by The Duc on July 26, 2011 at 6:42am

There are many opposite stories to yours.

When I was ten I had a friend who ended up in a coma for 3 weeks after taking a nasty spill on his bike and hitting his head and there were only 9 kids in my neighborhood that's why statisticians look at a group as whole not just your or my neighborhood. By the way 2009 Gallup poll of U.S. adults found that 90% supported helmet laws for children hardly a minority. 

 

Ahh, theres the cruix.

It's okay for you speak about not wearing a helmet but I'm not supposed to say anything to the contrary.

Thankfully it doesn't work that way in this country at least not yet.

 

Helmets and loud pipes are minor issues when it comes to motorcycle riding and something I feel the motorcycle community wastes it's time on as they do not actually impinge the right to ride.

I'd like to have the following addressed:

bicycle riders should pay road taxes (register them) before they get their own lanes and wide berth laws and get fines for not obeying traffic laws.

construction crews who hot top a single travel lane on the interstate so high a motorcyclists cannot switch lanes and fail to post as such in a timely manner.

Same goes for grooved pavement.

Why towns/cities allow pot holes that can swallow my motorcycle but insist on new crosswalks for pedestrians.

Drivers who throw out cigarettes, coffee and soda that hit me and clutter the roadway.

I could go on and on about stuff that actually impacts my riding and safety...

 

Anyway enjoy the ride with or without a helmet.

 

 

 

 

Mark Elliott said:

In some instances Duc, yes, but those instances are the minority and quite frankly I am tired of the minority telling me what to do. As far as my kids wearing helmets on their bicycles, I don't agree with that either. I was raised in a complex with over 400 families. Bicycles were our transportation, not our toys. We rode every day, all day and not once in that 15 year period did any of the kids in my neighborhood sustain a head injury that required medical attention. 400 families is a large enough data sample for me. But now, because a couple kids got hurt or maybe just because some outreaching parent decided we should all parent just like her, my kids have to wear a helmet to ride because it's the law. Those that choose to wear a helmet, should just close their lips and wear the damn thing.

  

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Permalink Reply by Mark Elliott on July 26, 2011 at 6:57am

Most "non helmeted" riders only speak in defense of their beliefs. When we see someone like yourself wearing a helmet, do we tell you to take it off?? No. For some reason it's ok for helmeted riders to not only tell us to put one on, but also tell us we're stupid for not wearing one and push legislation to force us to do so with the usual rhetoric about how it indirectly affects them.

 

Yes, there are just as many stories from both sides, there is also just as much factual data for both sides. At the end of the day, you won't ever see a non helmeted rider force his beliefs on you the way helmeted riders do to us.........

 

Anyways, thank you for the healthy debate.....it keeps us all on our toes.

 

The Duc said:

There are many opposite stories to yours.

When I was ten I had a friend who ended up in a coma for 3 weeks after taking a nasty spill on his bike and hitting his head and there were only 9 kids in my neighborhood that's why statisticians look at a group as whole not just your or my neighborhood. By the way 2009 Gallup poll of U.S. adults found that 90% supported helmet laws for children hardly a minority. 

 

Ahh, theres the cruix.

It's okay for you speak about not wearing a helmet but I'm not supposed to say anything to the contrary.

Thankfully it doesn't work that way in this country at least not yet.

 

Helmets and loud pipes are minor issues when it comes to motorcycle riding and something I feel the motorcycle community wastes it's time on as they do not actually impinge the right to ride.

I'd like to have the following addressed:

bicycle riders should pay road taxes (register them) before they get their own lanes and wide berth laws and get fines for not obeying traffic laws.

construction crews who hot top a single travel lane on the interstate so high a motorcyclists cannot switch lanes and fail to post as such in a timely manner.

Same goes for grooved pavement.

Why towns/cities allow pot holes that can swallow my motorcycle but insist on new crosswalks for pedestrians.

Drivers who throw out cigarettes, coffee and soda that hit me and clutter the roadway.

I could go on and on about stuff that actually impacts my riding and safety...

 

Anyway enjoy the ride with or without a helmet.

 

 

 

 

Mark Elliott said:

In some instances Duc, yes, but those instances are the minority and quite frankly I am tired of the minority telling me what to do. As far as my kids wearing helmets on their bicycles, I don't agree with that either. I was raised in a complex with over 400 families. Bicycles were our transportation, not our toys. We rode every day, all day and not once in that 15 year period did any of the kids in my neighborhood sustain a head injury that required medical attention. 400 families is a large enough data sample for me. But now, because a couple kids got hurt or maybe just because some outreaching parent decided we should all parent just like her, my kids have to wear a helmet to ride because it's the law. Those that choose to wear a helmet, should just close their lips and wear the damn thing.

 

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